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8:47 am
October 19, 2010
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mrsmoney
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So I have requested that Google reevaluate my page rank a few times. The first two times they wrote back and my page rank stayed at 0. This time, I told them what I thought was the problem and haven't heard anything back but it hasn't been that long. I just checked it using a page rank checker and it said n/a and that there are a few reasons it may be this way:
(1) the web page is new, and it is not indexed by
Google yet,
(2) the web page is indexed by Google, but it is not ranked
yet,
(3) the web page was indexed by Google long ago, but it is recognised
as a supplemental (Supplemental Results) page,
(4) the web page or the whole website is banned by
Google.
I am now worried that my site is banned by Google.
Thoughts?
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9:57 am
October 19, 2010
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ChristianPF
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can you share the site url?
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9:59 am
October 19, 2010
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mrsmoney
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This is the checker: http://www.google.com/url?sa=t…..mp;cad=rja
and I checked my site, http://ultimatemoneyblog.com
Thanks! :)
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11:11 am
October 19, 2010
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ChristianPF
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Well, when I google some phrases from your articles – your site comes up – so that means you aren't banned. I will say that I honestly haven't cared a bit about pagerank for the last couple years. Mine has gone from 0-2-3-0-4-5-3 and in all that variation – I didn't notice a change in my search engine traffic from Google – in fact it even went up sometimes when my PR was lowered.
So, I think that is the more important question – has your Google traffic changed?
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12:24 pm
October 19, 2010
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mrsmoney
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I don't think my traffic has really changed. I think I'll just keep doing what I'm doing and hope for the best! Thanks for your help :)
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2:41 pm
October 19, 2010
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ChristianPF
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yea unless you are selling textlinks (which is a bad idea anyway) what the little green bar says doesn't really matter that much…
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7:31 pm
October 19, 2010
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Budgeting in the Fun Stuff
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ChristianPF said:
yea unless you are selling textlinks (which is a bad idea anyway) what the little green bar says doesn't really matter that much…
If PR doesn't matter except for textlinks, than why is it a bad idea to sell them? Worse come to worse, your PR drops and you can't sell as many, but it shouldn't matter for the big picture, right? It sounds like selling textlinks isn't so bad after all. ;-)
Crystal
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8:41 pm
October 19, 2010
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pfincome
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I sold textlinks early on with my site and saw my PR drop to 0. I have since removed them over a year ago and I still remain at 0. Very frustrating!
How did you contact Google to reevaluate your ranking?
Thanks,
John -
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4:27 am
October 20, 2010
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Glen Craig
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How did you contact Google to reevaluate your ranking?
I beleive it's in Google Webmaster Tools.
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6:52 am
October 20, 2010
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ChristianPF
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If PR doesn't matter except for textlinks, than why is it a bad idea to sell them? Worse come to worse, your PR drops and you can't sell as many, but it shouldn't matter for the big picture, right? It sounds like selling textlinks isn't so bad after all. ;-)
For me I make my living from Google, so I kind of look at it like biting the hand that feeds me. But for others who may not have any other reasons for playing by Google's rules, when I stopped selling links (about 2 years ago) I noticed a drastic increase in Google traffic over the following few months. I can't be 100% sure it wasn't a coincidence, but based on how vocal they have been about their stance on selling links it would make sense that they would punish those who weren't playing by their rules – and reward those who are… just something to think about…
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7:05 am
October 20, 2010
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Budgeting in the Fun Stuff
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It's hard for me to accept that Google cares much. I sell links and have a PR2. Some fellow blogging friends haven't sold links ever and still have a PR0 (for months now). The blog I staff write for has obvious homepage links like I do and is a PR4.
I don't get much traffic from search engines, but I do come up on the first page of Google for a few words…I just don't write for SEO. So, I don't know if my search engines traffic is cruddy because I just don't write with SEO in mind or because I sell text links.
So I'm confused with Google and rather not make money-making decisions with a bully company in mind. But obviously, that is a totally personal choice.
Crystal
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7:26 am
October 20, 2010
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Khaleef @ KNS Financial
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Budgeting in the Fun Stuff said:
It's hard for me to accept that Google cares much. I sell links and have a PR2. Some fellow blogging friends haven't sold links ever and still have a PR0 (for months now). The blog I staff write for has obvious homepage links like I do and is a PR4.
I don't get much traffic from search engines, but I do come up on the first page of Google for a few words…I just don't write for SEO. So, I don't know if my search engines traffic is cruddy because I just don't write with SEO in mind or because I sell text links.
So I'm confused with Google and rather not make money-making decisions with a bully company in mind. But obviously, that is a totally personal choice.
Crystal
I agree with you Crystal, and probably for the same reasons. I don't get a lot of search engine traffic (still an SEO rookie), and I also hate the idea of Google controlling everything that we do. What is the point of releasing page ranks and telling sites that getting links is the best way to improve it, and then telling the ones with good PRs not to make any money from their good PR?
What is the point of PR, anyway? Is it just so you know how popular you are, or are there practical reasons? I'm asking because I honestly don't know, not to be antagonistic.
Well, most of you know that I hate Google anyway – I won't go into why here (but many of you have seen that thread as well)!
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9:27 am
October 20, 2010
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moneysmarts
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If you look at it from Google's point of view, when you sell text links you're basically trying to game their system and their search engine by making a site that might not otherwise be very popular – more popular in the search results – thus skewing their search results to a degree. They don't like that as the search game is their bread and butter.
On Smart On Money I'm not selling text links, and I stopped selling text links a while back on my main site after it dropped from a PR5 to a PR3. While the text link income was nice, I was making enough from adsense that I didn't want to chance losing my search users and adsense income to my site because of the text links i've sold.
While you may not see much of a change in the number of people finding you via search right now, google can change their system at any time and decide that selling text links means you are given a penalty – or you won't show in search results. I don't want to chance it personally, although I think that's a choice others will have to make on their own. I know I accepted text link income for the first year or so of my first site, and it was pretty lucrative. Only now that I have diversified the income a bit more have i removed them.
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10:04 am
October 20, 2010
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Budgeting in the Fun Stuff
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I might stop selling text links if I ever have any other income source, but I doubt it. Paying someone to skew search results isn't any different than all those people who pop up first on search results because they paid Google directly. Or all of us bloggers that happily link to each other like crazy people to help all of us get bigger.
I understand they have the right to penalize me when it comes to their rating system or even their search results. I just rather end up being a PR0 to Google on my own terms than accept their bullying dominance games. They have the choice to penalize sites or simply ignore the links they don't think hold value. They choose to penalize. That seems bullying to me.
Crystal
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10:49 am
October 20, 2010
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Khaleef @ KNS Financial
| | Fat Guy, Skinny Wallet | |
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Budgeting in the Fun Stuff said:
I might stop selling text links if I ever have any other income source, but I doubt it. Paying someone to skew search results isn't any different than all those people who pop up first on search results because they paid Google directly. Or all of us bloggers that happily link to each other like crazy people to help all of us get bigger.
I understand they have the right to penalize me when it comes to their rating system or even their search results. I just rather end up being a PR0 to Google on my own terms than accept their bullying dominance games. They have the choice to penalize sites or simply ignore the links they don't think hold value. They choose to penalize. That seems bullying to me.
Crystal
I completely agree. I understand that it's their choice, but I hate that we allow a site to dictate how much money we can make. We either lose our search engine status, or we lose income (unless Google graciously gives us a few dollars with Adsense) – it just doesn't seem right! Like you said, they make money by people skewing the search results, but penalize us for trying to do the same!
@ Money Smarts – it's really sad that you were super popular and they dropped you like that because they didn't like the way you made money.
If I was allowed to have Adsense, then I probably would be more careful. Like you said, everyone has to make that choice, and I would never advise someone to sell text links without telling them what you guys have shared.
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4:30 am
October 21, 2010
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Glen Craig
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Paying someone to skew search results isn't any different than all those
people who pop up first on search results because they paid Google
directly.
Paid search is entirely different. Those are the few paid results you see at the top in a different colored box as well as what you see on the side. You do not get paid results in the organic rankings.
I think we tend to forget that this is all their game that we are playing. When people search for something online the odds are they are looking on google. Let's face it, many of us are blogging because we think we can make money at it. The major reason we CAN make any money is Google's existence and their expertise in search.
Remember, Google's main base is providing the best search results for the user. If sites are gaming the system then they are changing what the best results are so Google does what it can to prevent gaming. This isn't bullying. If Google didn't do this it would dramatically change the search results we see when we search. Believe it or not, when Google penalizes a site for links it helps us all have a fair shot.
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4:34 am
October 21, 2010
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Financial Samurai
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Post edited 4:43 am – October 21, 2010 by Financial Samurai
Good Discussion guys. I live in SF and am friends with 6 people who work at Google. They work in indexing, adwords, marketing, etc. They ALL told me that webmasters can do whatever they want and that they don't have the ability or authority to punish/police you.
An example used is let's say your good friend starts his website and wants to sell a txt link on your site. You don't accept money, but a beer. Who is Google to say what you can and cannot do for your friend? Nobody. Furthermore, how do they prove anything? Finally, many major corporations has an SEO department. Are they all getting banned? Of course not. USAA, my family's insurance carrier for over 40 years contacted me about advertising, and I was honored to do so. Is a company like USAA, who insures millions of US war veterans and current soldiers going to get banned? Of course not! I personally am not a fan of Adsense ads and am happy to choose what gets displayed and not what someone tells me to do.
If you blog full-time and make a ton from Adsense or marketing, sure why bother. If not, sure why not exercise your liberty.
Cheers
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Regards,
Sam
Financial Samurai - Helping you achieve financial freedom sooner, rather than later.
Yakezie Network Founder
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9:13 am
October 21, 2010
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Suba @ Wealth Informatics
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Post edited 9:39 am – October 21, 2010 by Suba @ Wealth Informatics
I don't monetize my site so my opinion might not have any value  but here goes -
We are talking 2 different things here (1) advertising to get traffic/people (2) testlink ads with keywords for link juice. If I am not mistaken google hates the type 2 and NOT type 1, because type 2 is gaming their system. They want to show good content in the front page as people don't go beyond that. By adding the link with a keyword it is artificially bringing that website to the front page which as a "user" I hate, so I appreciate google for weeding out the results. I see that as a part of their algortihm to stay competitive. It is due to these advertisement type websites I never went to live search, but I see bing is improving. And if you have the type 1 advertising, they do not penalize, which I think is fair. All they ask is to add a nofollow, people who click on the ad and go to the USAA or whatever website don't care if it is nofollow or dofollow, I wasn't even aware such thing existed as a user, until I started a blog. So as a user I don't want to see the artificially "good" results on the front page and now as a blogger, I think that gives me a fair playing ground to compete with those with money to pay for keyword links.
Regarding pagerank, I think this is how it gets used – if you have excellent content (however they rank the content I do not know) you will rank high, but if you have great content and high page rank (plus other authority stuff) you might rank higher than the excellent content with page rank 0. Anyone can choose to ignore pagerank (right now as a PR0 I have chosen to  ) but the text link sellers are going to be interested in page rank, as that is what they want. Whereas the type 1 advertisers are not interested in pagerank, they want your site to be popular to get traffic. They won't care if I lose my page rank. To have a diversified and somewhat stable income, these are the best kind of advertisers to have I suppose.
If you choose to not have adsense and go with advertisers, it is your blog, your decision and inspite of the common misconception that google doesn't like it, google does support your decision. They don't penalize. It is the text links they penalize and as it is gaming the algorithm I see it as a fair point. I might choose to sell textlinks in the future if the money is lucrative, but if they penalize me for that (some sites/links are not penalized), I understand and will have a back up plan. So the money has to be pretty lucrative.
Finally I think it comes down to as Bob said – don't bite the hand that feeds you, if you are getting most of your visitors from google, play by the rules. If you have a loyal following that doesn't care for the ads that you put up on your site, more power to you, use it to its full extend.
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11:00 am
October 21, 2010
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Khaleef @ KNS Financial
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They may say that they don't penalize for accepting pay for textlinks, but too many bloggers have had their PR drop significantly while every metric associated with links and traffic were growing. The only change was that they started posting these links.
I always wonder how they can tell the difference between someone posting a list of favorite blogs/websites, helpful resources for their readers, and textlinks.
So, is pagerank they way that they determine your position in search results? Meaning, I write about the biblical perspective on finances (among other things), so does Bob (Christian PF); if we write about the same topic, will he always rank higher because he has a higher PR?
I guess you can tell that I have a lot to learn about this stuff. Thanks to everyone for humoring my questions.
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11:31 am
October 21, 2010
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Suba @ Wealth Informatics
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KNS Financial said:
They may say that they don't penalize for accepting pay for textlinks, but too many bloggers have had their PR drop significantly while every metric associated with links and traffic were growing. The only change was that they started posting these links.
I always wonder how they can tell the difference between someone posting a list of favorite blogs/websites, helpful resources for their readers, and textlinks.
So, is pagerank they way that they determine your position in search results? Meaning, I write about the biblical perspective on finances (among other things), so does Bob (Christian PF); if we write about the same topic, will he always rank higher because he has a higher PR?
I guess you can tell that I have a lot to learn about this stuff. Thanks to everyone for humoring my questions.
Khaleef,
They DO penalize for accepting pay for textlinks. All I am saying is they don't penalize you for accepting advertisements and marking them as a nofollow. There is a difference. They do have algorithms to detect paid links. I have no idea how they see which is paid and which is not, but they have been reasonably good in doing that (in my limited and humble opinion). Here is the answer straight from the horse's mouth – http://www.google.com/support/…..swer=66736
So, is pagerank they way that they determine your position in search
results? Meaning, I write about the biblical perspective on finances
(among other things), so does Bob (Christian PF); if we write about the
same topic, will he always rank higher because he has a higher PR?
It is not just as straight forward as this. Page rank is "one" of the factors, it was the main factor when they started but they have evolved. So if Bob has all the other things right according to them for one post and you have very high quality links from relevant sites saying yours is a great post, you will rank high for that post. They do penalize people selling/buying links, they even have a reporting system as you can see from the link.
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